For the general purpose of keeping track of whatever it is I do, so that I don't have to hijack other threads each time I make something.
Granted, I also tend towards the wordy side of the spectrum, so this is really for people who are interested in how I work. That said, if you just want to shoot the shit (pun intended), that's game too. I'd welcome the discussion.
A bit about myself:
I guess I'd be one of the older (read: ancient) members of the internet "nyou" community. I've been around since the old Yahoo groups days with Micro and Jupiter, and have migrated around the Web with the rest of the flock wherever it went. I was never really an active member though, so treat me like any newcomer.
Though I've never pursued either hobby seriously, I'm a capable writer and artist. I find a certain enjoyment in those activities, as the whole creative process is really far removed from what I usually do for a living. I also toy with new software depending on my fluctuating interests, and as of late have begun employing Photoshop as a coloring tool.
Ideology-wise, I'll say it right now: I'd rather do something for the "awesome" rather than for the "porn," so expect faux pas and stuff out of left field that disregard inherent fappability. Sure, that misses the point of this site: but that's what keeps us motivated and the learning of our respective crafts interesting.
And...that's it, really.
In my line of work, I have to adhere to a very strict development schedule, so I can only do nyou stuff whenever things calm down on the "legit" business end.
For anything else though, I'll be around.
Thanks all of you again for the feedback on the Sakura pic.
Now that I take a closer look at it, I'm finally noticing Chun-Li's awkward lip thing. It was an overdrawing mistake on my part! By then, I must've been so tired from staring at that image for weeks that I didn't notice. I'll take note and double-check next time I work on something.
Maybe it's because I'm not used to it, but it'll be a while before I can muster the energy to follow through on something that demanding again. Monochrome art and "dirty" handsketches, on the other hand...that, I can do. Personally, I enjoy original material more than fan-stuff, but the latter is also interesting to work on every now and then. To emulate a distinctive art style can actually be quite challenging!
(Just...keep in mind that there are certain shows that I wouldn't stoop down to touching, even with an eleven-foot pole. And that spamming the forums requesting it won't change anyone's mind about it. To hell with this, you know who you are.)
Right now though, what I'm thinking of is writing a story for the site.
Not to add to an existing universe, not to enter a contest, not to get reviews...more like an experiment just for the hell of it.
Granted, I wouldn't be going for the good ol' fap 'n go, so how interesting the story itself would be is quite debatable. All the same, I think all of us could stand to open our minds further on how to approach writing, and the first step to that is just to keep trying new things, for better or for worse. And of course by trying out new things, I mean tone, articulation, setup, mood...not new fetishes!
So while this means most of the nyou material would be incidental or a gimmick rather than the backbone of the story, I'm wondering if anyone would still be interested in reading something like that?
I would be very interested in a serious story, with "nyou elements" as a secondary concern. As it stands now, the majority of the stories on this site are vessels for poop/pee fetishes, rather than an actual story. Now, don't get me wrong, I enjoy reading the posts on ToiletStool a great deal. But I feel like that particular site is more set up to share anecdotes and use an informal sort of writing, as if the person were telling the story in real life.
In the end, it comes down to this: For me personally, if I want a quick fix for a fetish story, I'll probably just go look on ToiletStool. But, if I want to get immersed in a story, I'd like this to be the go-to place.
I agree. I'm absolutely fine with that sort of thing, and actually, I encourage it.
I don't mind if the pee/poop elements only make up a small part of the story. I've posted some stories like that myself.
Well the bathroom stuff is important, of course. This is nyou after all. :P But yea it is nice to try and flesh out the story with some pacing so it's not just detailed a bathroom excursion (not that that isn't alright from time to time) ;)
The really big problem when attempting something like this is to first figure out how to integrate the nyou elements into the greater picture. As far as I know, there are only 2 ways for those scenes to make sense without looking too out of place:
1) Its implications are an integral part of the overall arching plot. A switch-and-bait maneuver, it is relevant because it actually has an important effect on the story's direction.
nyou example: Schizophrenia
2) It's a recurring gimmick, an integral part of the story's language itself. It's shameless, it's absurd, it knows what it is and that's the whole point.
nyou example: Melina
If neither of those points are respected, then the story becomes an excuse plot (or as Majora4 puts it so eloquently, fetish vessels). Sometimes it works, but most of the time it will lack direction and suffer from transitionary rough spots, yes?
Conversely, I think we can all agree that if a story is given a very clear direction right off the bat, then anything goes.
Some of the more memorable stories from the site become so due to this, even if not always for the most cerebral of reasons. Anything Yarr touches could be probably counted as distilled fun that doesn't take itself too seriously. The Sakura fic knows what it is, and it works because it doesn't compromise on that. These are also good examples of how fics don't actually have to be maudlin and serious all the time to convey a story successfully, as vacuous as plots tend to become when overloaded with porn. It's why humor lends itself so well to this genre.
You know, I'm kind of glad I got Jimmy and Bluesniper in here. Out of all the people on this site, I figured you two would know what I'm trying to get at.
Jimmy, I've always been a fan of your easygoing style: it flows naturally, and I can't think of another word to describe the way you write. You seem to be one of the few writers here who actually takes time to establish his fictional credit through thorough fleshing out of characters and settings. This lends to a narrative all kinds of imagery, color, life. The author stops being a creator and becomes a storyteller: events stop unfolding because the plot inexorably demands it, but instead do so because that is the natural course of the universe in question, and that is how the entities within respond. No matter how pulp the fiction, or how alien the concept, or perhaps even how at times it may be difficult to take your own inventions seriously due to winging it, I think you're one of the few authors on this site who consistently pull this off with some skill. And it is good to see.
...And yes, this is a porn site. I'm just saying, though. You know you've got a nice premise on your hands when it could be potentially interesting even without the nyou elements. That's not the fun part for the author, true, but it makes it fun to read.
Bluesniper, I have a confession: I was actually thinking of making an Axon Corps picture before I finally opted for the Chun-Li & Sakura one. I'll admit this decision was in part because that series is just more popular and would be better received, but I do have lingering regrets. In the little free time I have, I would've really enjoyed working on something original. Hell, an original retro mecha series? Fuck yeah, I'd work on that.
I think you're one of the more ambitious writers here, willing to drive simple ideas and concepts as far as you can take them. This betrays an underlying urge to create, explore new things, or at the very least marks a pronounced interest in looking for something different. On this, at the very least, we might think alike. Hopefully we'll see more of you again!
This is encouraging, and I think I'll get back to brainstorming that story. I'll throw the general gist of it out here when most details are crystallized, and see if I can bounce back some feedback off of you guys.
Yes, this is a pron site, but in my opinion, anything goes. Hell, I know for example, that I could write a story, say similar to the ridicilous Sakura chapters and make a epic dump descriptive and so forth without using deliberate erotic language.
Sure, those into butts and farts would have a field day, but more from their own mind then me deliberately spicing up the language.
Kind of seeing that amazing woman walking down the street; shes doing just that, but for the right person observing its very nice :P
Actually, I might give something like that a try myself. Maybe. :kawaii:
Yes... yes. You should get your lazy ass back to writing. :P
Quote from: nkay7 on August 17, 2011, 12:18:57 AM
You know, I'm kind of glad I got Jimmy and Bluesniper in here. Out of all the people on this site, I figured you two would know what I'm trying to get at.I think you're one of the more ambitious writers here, willing to drive simple ideas and concepts as far as you can take them. This betrays an underlying urge to create, explore new things, or at the very least marks a pronounced interest in looking for something different. On this, at the very least, we might think alike. Hopefully we'll see more of you again!
What am I? Chopped liver? Not like a couple of my stories don't have great prose to them. :-[ :P
@Yarr
Come to think of it, the slice-of-life and purely "observational" approach may very well also be a viable alternative for a good story, in instances where plot isn't a primary concern. I stand corrected, good sir. But that would mean someone like you just needs to be the "right person" observing, now wouldn't it? ;)
@Orpheum
Ha! True enough, Orpheum. You do have stories I have enjoyed a lot. I wasn't purposefully giving out a peer review or anything of the sort, just saying what came to my mind. Allrighty then, let's talk about you.
Let's see, the vibe I get from your writing is more that of erotic fanfiction for the sake of erotic fanfiction: however, combined with an impressive willingness to ride the Zeitgeist and beat the topic of the day while it's hot. Perhaps the best way to describe it would be like running a weekly column in a syndicated paper: due to the sheer quantity and variety of work you've produced over the years, you've become a nyou fixture of sorts, comfortable enough that anything you make is almost guaranteed to meet a certain level of standards. The Orpheum brand, if you will. Conversely, bearing a brand also carries its share of implications: some lofty, some constricting.
Certainly I don't need to tell you Internet leechdom is a fickle thing: creators often find themselves cornered by their audience to become mere enablers of selfish requests and personal fapquests. This is the bane of the brand: in exchange for more of the same, it discourages change, stifles creativity, murders artistic curiosity. But I suppose that on the bright side, in a small community like this one, at least you get to choose whether an audience matters or not to you. Deviantart has proven that some people certainly wear their brand like a badge of honor, if that works for them. That's all I'll say about that.
As for your prose style itself, as something that molds itself to fit purpose and circumstance, it is hard to define in a few words. It is certainly competent, certainly entertaining. And you have your moments of brilliance, I'll grant you that; if anything, it just goes to show that you can be quite versatile when you want. I understand that you're an aspiring author, yes? I'm curious: not limiting ourselves to nyou fiction, what would you like to write about? Write for?
*Sigh*
On that note, I do apologize to everyone here if I always sound insufferably categorical. As you might have noted, I have a crippling tendency to overthink things out loud (but shhh~! Don't tell anyone!), but the truth is that I'm always interested in hearing other opinions. Chalk it up to being a geek purist.
To some people, the process of learning is synonymous to leisure: alas, I understand tis' not an universal truth, and have long given up on demanding of those around me what I demand of myself. That said, please do take everything I say with a grain of salt.
I almost feel like we're getting our fortunes read by an old gypsy woman or something. :P
ME NEXT, MADAM NKAY! DO ME NEXT!
Quote from: nkay7 on August 17, 2011, 10:54:20 PM
@Orpheum
Ha! True enough, Orpheum. You do have stories I have enjoyed a lot. I wasn't purposefully giving out a peer review or anything of the sort, just saying what came to my mind. Allrighty then, let's talk about you.
Let's see, the vibe I get from your writing is more that of erotic fanfiction for the sake of erotic fanfiction: however, combined with an impressive willingness to ride the Zeitgeist and beat the topic of the day while it's hot. Perhaps the best way to describe it would be like running a weekly column in a syndicated paper: due to the sheer quantity and variety of work you've produced over the years, you've become a nyou fixture of sorts, comfortable enough that anything you make is almost guaranteed to meet a certain level of standards. The Orpheum brand, if you will. Conversely, bearing a brand also carries its share of implications: some lofty, some constricting.
As for your prose style itself, as something that molds itself to fit purpose and circumstance, it is hard to define in a few words. It is certainly competent, certainly entertaining. And you have your moments of brilliance, I'll grant you that; if anything, it just goes to show that you can be quite versatile when you want. I understand that you're an aspiring author, yes? I'm curious: not limiting ourselves to nyou fiction, what would you like to write about? Write for?
Oh come on, plenty of my stories have great themes to them, you can't deny
No Need for Desperation! had a great little mystery surrounding the girls mysteriously all needing to go at once; or that
One Wild Night presented a shining example of the cute, bubbly girl archetype that we know exist, but are often hard to come by. :P But you do have to admit it's important to have the eroticism since this is largely an adult site, not that some plot doesn't help to spice things up. As for my stories, I have been told that regardless of the great/not so greatness of the story, they're always enjoyable in, some way, which is something quite rare for an untrained writer as my myself (I've never had anything beyond your standard English and Litertature classes).
On the fiction side, I've said before I do fanfiction on ff.net, and have actually since around late 2002, though it's only been since about 05-06 that I started writing genuinely more deep and involved stuff and not just goofy parodies, which were my big thing for longest time. And I already have finished my first novel (again), and just have to get some people to look it over so I can gather notes on things that need fixing/changing. Then of course I also have my big animated series that I've been planning since I was about 9-10, though I can never agree with myself on how certain details (like how everything begins, though I do have a rough idea of the end...).
@Toasty
QuoteI almost feel like we're getting our fortunes read by an old gypsy woman or something. :P
ME NEXT, MADAM NKAY! DO ME NEXT!
I 've never quite seen it that way! It's not so much reading fortunes as simple abstraction and commentary; as any opinion, it's by no means absolute, either. That said, are you quite certain you'd want me to offer a crit of your work? There's always the very real possibility that I might not like it, and express that dislike to you in the bluntest way possible, right? Be careful what you wish for, young seeker. ;)
Seriously though, I'm not into the messing scene. The
pantypoop tag is one of those red flags I stay away from, and I haven't actually read any of those stories. Nothing personal, it's just one of those facets of the fetish I don't quite understand, so I couldn't offer you much insight. Yes, I am aware of the hypocrisy!
@Orpheum
Hmm...I'd rather not comment directly on any exact title, and I'll just agree that all your stories each have at least something enjoyable.
Despite what I said to Toasty, I'm just not
mean enough to make a good critic of anything. The worst I'd do is give you some food for thought.
For example, I know you've got your sources down pat: you demonstrate remarkable understanding of the universes your fanfiction draws from, and of the characters your write about. We've also established that your writing is competent: so where then do you think the problem would lie? Why would some of your stories be considered weaker than others, if the contents are so thematically similar? Do you think it might just be a question of erotic intensity, or is there another factor at play?
Me, I'll just suggest that you take more risks to your usual approach, as you might learn to improve even further in surprising ways. You're not quite out of your comfort zone yet, and I'd definitely like to see you attempt something like that. Hell, you might find the experience interesting too, even if it ultimately doesn't turn out the way you want. But that's just me.
QuoteBut you do have to admit it's important to have the eroticism since this is largely an adult site, not that some plot doesn't help to spice things up.
As for my stories, I have been told that regardless of the great/not so greatness of the story, they're always enjoyable in, some way, which is something quite
rare for an untrained writer as my myself (I've never had anything beyond your standard English and Litertature classes).
I never said anything to the contrary. As a matter of fact, that's the main attraction of these stories, and you understand that quite well. You've probably heard the comical expression
"God has given Man a brain and a dick, but only enough blood to operate one at a time" ? Applies here as much as anything, and that's the way it should be. I mean, seriously! Do I look like I parse for intellectual content when I read stories about toilet terrorists? I like this stuff as much as the next guy here, and by extension that means I enjoy yours too.
It's just that a breath of fresh air every now and then is nice, and having a plot on top is a way to do that.
It pleasantly surprises. It adds multivalence. It makes people wonder why they never thought of such and such approach before.
Every genre of literature faces redundance, even fanfiction: it is an inevitable part of the cycle, as themes and ideas are exhausted through exploration, or lose their relevance as trends and popculture change. That's when previously acceptable material starts to lose their edge, and people start questioning what made them so interesting in the first place. The only remedy to that is further innovation, through which the cycle is reborn anew. And so on, and so on, and so on.
So yeah, this is not English class, thank God. We nyou members aren't the biggest bunch of monocle-wearing sophists either, even if I like tea with my english biscuits. But eschewing pure porn and trying something else? Why the hell not? Short of inducing instant flaccidity, the worse that could happen is just that not as many people would read it. But it might be worth it just to find new grounds to thread.
Oh well. It won't be said that I didn't push for this.
Quote
On the fiction side, I've said before I do fanfiction on ff.net, and have actually since around late 2002, though it's only been since about 05-06 that I
started writing genuinely more deep and involved stuff and not just goofy parodies, which were my big thing for longest time. And I already have finished my
first novel (again), and just have to get some people to look it over so I can gather notes on things that need fixing/changing. Then of course I also have my
big animated series that I've been planning since I was about 9-10, though I can never agree with myself on how certain details (like how everything begins,
though I do have a rough idea of the end...).
I believe goofy parody in itself can be quite an involving genre too, if you really know what you're parodying. Seeing how fond you are of nostalgia cartoons, how about a pitch for an original saturday morning nyou cartoon? It's this kind of surreal undertaking that draws out from all the culture you accumulate in a lifetime, and regurgitates it into something new. Certainly, it would be more challenging to make than direct parodies of Naruto and Street Fighter and whatnot, but just as fads lose their relevance and are forgotten in time, true satire becomes timeless. It's just a thought, but you have to admit that sounds right up your alley.
I'm amazed I'm even talking about this stuff on the nyou forum. It's a good thing I have my own thread, if only so people can avoid it altogether!
Quote from: nkay7 on August 19, 2011, 02:51:13 AM
Short of inducing instant flaccidity
Hahahahahah
Anyway, it's fine if you don't want to look at my stuff due to subject matter, although I have some stories without pantypoop (Hermione's Plan, Bathroom Turnabout, Method Acting, and Lute's New Hobby). Don't worry about my ego - I can handle honest criticism, because I'm confident in my ability to improve based on feedback. If somebody raises a legitimate complaint with my writing, it's not the end of the world. You just gotta work with it.
Your criticism is so well thought out and in depth that is seems a shame to waste this opportunity just because of a little squeamishness. If you said everything was perfect, how would that help me as a writer anyway? Take a gander at my stuff if you so desire, but if not that's fine too.
Not to mention, most of that stuff is over a year old anyway, and I'd like to think that I've improved since the time of its writing. That doesn't mean that a critique wouldn't be helpful, though.
To get slightly back on topic, I'd love to see a story of the sort you described, and I'd surely return the favor to the best of my abilities if you wanted feedback on it.
Quote from: Toasty on August 19, 2011, 03:36:12 AM
Hahahahahah
Anyway, it's fine if you don't want to look at my stuff due to subject matter, although I have some stories without pantypoop (Hermione's Plan, Bathroom Turnabout, Method Acting, and Lute's New Hobby). Don't worry about my ego - I can handle honest criticism, because I'm confident in my ability to improve based on feedback. If somebody raises a legitimate complaint with my writing, it's not the end of the world. You just gotta work with it.
Your criticism is so well thought out and in depth that is seems a shame to waste this opportunity just because of a little squeamishness. If you said everything was perfect, how would that help me as a writer anyway? Take a gander at my stuff if you so desire, but if not that's fine too.
Not to mention, most of that stuff is over a year old anyway, and I'd like to think that I've improved since the time of its writing. That doesn't mean that a critique wouldn't be helpful, though.
To get slightly back on topic, I'd love to see a story of the sort you described, and I'd surely return the favor to the best of my abilities if you wanted feedback on it.
...Yeah, this turned out to be anything but an update thread...
Well Toasty, I'm happy that you value my input enough to actually ask for it: but before moving any further, I have a feeling I should establish my credentials and go through with my own story project. If it comes out right, and if I apply my ideas right, I'd have an easier time explaining certain things down the road, too. Besides, no one respects big heads who can talk the talk but can't walk the walk.
That said, for now I can point out a few general things about your work if you want. Now that you mention those titles, I do recognize your stories! I remember reading all of those you named, as a matter of fact. Probably the one that struck me the most was the
Method Acting one, and that was a looong way back. If you hadn't mentionned it just now, I think I might have remembered it as a Jimmy fic instead, since it just sounds more like something he'd do. I do apologize for my mistake.
So, on the top of my head...
Method Acting is interesting, in more ways than one. There's the story, there's the "scene"...yet what pops out to me is the framework. It makes me realize this is like one the few stories on this site with enough structure to actually incorporate a punchline of sorts. The nyou material is also integrated into the fabric of the plot, so it never feels out of place either. It's a
self-contained piece, and I'm surprised I haven't seen more of these (again, except out of Jimmy).
Now, I'm aware there are writers out there who push for free-form writing, as traditional formatting (AKA, setup, buildup, conflict, resolution) sometimes just doesn't cut it in brisker-paced narratives. And in a media like ours that's specifically designed to titillate, it's because no one cares about the shirtless milkman & lonely housewife setup anymore the moment the funky porn riff kicks in. This does create an interesting distinction: on one side, you'd have the usual short stories that are really just a linear string of pornographic depictions slapped back-to-back. And on the other, sometimes you find short stories like this one, that actually bother building up plot elements for the explicit purpose of knocking them down in the end and make a point (or a joke): there are no residual leftovers here, no wasted ideas, no indulgence in arbitrary content.
"Less is more," yes?
Method Acting follows a classical
farce format: it introduces absurd situations, blunders and misunderstandings over the course of the story, and ultimately untangles the conflict with a happy and comical resolution. I'm not going to say that this is the most brilliant example of such a story, but just by the virtue of having plot elements work towards the planned ending like this already makes the work a bit more layered than the usual stuff. Contrast with the
Harry Potter fic, which also contain some elements of this (ridiculous means to a ridiculous end, played straight), with the
Fire Emblem and
Phoenix Wright ones, which don't (
raw pornaaaaaaage!!!).
All I can say is that it's one of those subtle things that you either gun for, or you don't. Most untrained writers would just approach their stories like serials, throwing out as many open threads as possible, so that any of these could be revisited or retconned at a later date (if their story even lasted that long!). One-shots on the other hand aren't designed to address things like character development or expansion of the canon: you could say it's the purest manifestation of a concept or an idea committed to story form, with the overlying theme acting as the cohesive agent that makes the whole greater than the sum of its parts. It's a more modest and elegant solution...and unfortunately also an underappreciated one, which is a shame.
Long story short: the setup has
purpose or it doesn't. But I've said too much already.
Again for standard nyou fiction, most pretenses at being something more just stop mattering after the
pow chikawow wow, symphony of blowing butt chunks and all that jazz.
Okay, phew! Back on topic now.
Actually, just discussing this stuff out loud has made me seriously reconsider what I had been planning towards my own story. After a few trials and errors, I've come up with this.
Sometimes ago, I suggested a
stylistic contest, instead of the usual
"thematic" one. The idea was received about as well as you might imagine, which is just a polite way of saying that
no one gave half a fuck. Looking back, I guess it's one of those things that had no chance of working unless I first showed I was myself willing to do it, and so I'll do that now.
I'll kick off with a story written entirely in
Noir style. The objectives of the project will be multi-fold:
1) Demonstrate that there are alternative methods to exposition through stylistic choice of narrative pace and tone
2) Demonstrate the strength of a self-contained piece by providing a setup which gets addressed and ultimately deconstructed
3) To incorporate Nyou content incidentally rather than as the focus, allowing for the seamless existence of plot
4) To experiment and just have fun with it.
So, it'd be porn with plot...and the challenge would be to adjust how much
porn, and how much
plot. I'll probably stick with a male hero protagonist just to nod to the genre, so descriptions would be less intimate and more voyeuristic...although in a gritty style like
Noir, I'm not sure how to incorporate nyou voyeurism without having it take undertones of sexual harrassment/rape, too. It could still manage to be funny, but more in a cynical way. I'm still not up to that part in the actual writing, so anyone's got a few suggestions they'd be willing to part with?
Quote from: OrpheumZero on August 18, 2011, 12:33:34 PM
Then of course I also have my big animated series that I've been planning since I was about 9-10, though I can never agree with myself on how certain details (like how everything begins, though I do have a rough idea of the end...).
This sounds intriguing. What is the premise?
Quote from: Jimmy Olsen on August 21, 2011, 02:38:14 AM
This sounds intriguing. What is the premise?
Hehehe, I'm always a little weary of revealing the idea online because of the fear that someone could steal it, but I guess it's nothing to be really concerned about.
Originally, the series started out a simple "play time" thing I had with some toys, except I had created quite a bit of backstory to each "character" (originally being McDonald Beast War toys), something most kids probably rarely did when just playing around pretend (at least more so than "This guy is a super warrior!"). Anyway, as I started to roll the idea of a series around, I incorporated elements of Dragon Ball Z, at the time being a very big fan, making it very action heavy. Granted, I was quick to make each character fight uniquely so it wasn't DBZ's "Everyone's a clone with the same move set".
The premise, so far at least, is that an alien prince from a world of shape-shifters (possibly the first sentient race to gain higher intelligence) comes to earth to conquer it. Four brothers, animals that have been transformed into human-like being (ala Ninja Turtles, only with a different origin and not ninjas) join forces with other alien princes, both of whom are rock-people. Together, the six face take on the villainous prince, Morpheus. The story would take place over the course of 15 years, and goes from simply battling Morpheus, to battling the dark empire he's a part of in far off galaxies. I've already got a general idea of how it would end, though I'm always caught between trying to make it somewhat realistic (meaning nothing gets too Gainax-y, but at the same time allow for the usual soft sci-fi elements like super powers and the like).
Then of course there is the fact that I want the series to last a long time, actually hoping that it could run for several years and almost realistically play out over the 15 year timeline rather than jumping and skipping periods every x amount of episodes. Luckily, I do have plenty of characters, and had even settled on trying to make focus be more on anyone, rather than picking one central protagonist. One thing I also want to achieve, is the idea that evil can win at times as well. Meaning that bad guys may get away with their plots at times, and even kill others, as the series is basically about an ever escalating war that has gone on for eons. Without spoiling what happens exactly, I'm even tempted to end the series with the villains winning, something that believe would set the series apart from others.
ETA - thanks for the awesome fortune :P I think you've pretty much summed me up perfectly.
Quote from: nkay7 on August 21, 2011, 12:41:21 AM
Sometimes ago, I suggested a stylistic contest, instead of the usual "thematic" one. The idea was received about as well as you might imagine, which is just a polite way of saying that no one gave half a fuck. Looking back, I guess it's one of those things that had no chance of working unless I first showed I was myself willing to do it, and so I'll do that now.
I'll kick off with a story written entirely in Noir style. The objectives of the project will be multi-fold:
1) Demonstrate that there are alternative methods to exposition through stylistic choice of narrative pace and tone
2) Demonstrate the strength of a self-contained piece by providing a setup which gets addressed and ultimately deconstructed
3) To incorporate Nyou content incidentally rather than as the focus, allowing for the seamless existence of plot
4) To experiment and just have fun with it.
So, it'd be porn with plot...and the challenge would be to adjust how much porn, and how much plot. I'll probably stick with a male hero protagonist just to nod to the genre, so descriptions would be less intimate and more voyeuristic...although in a gritty style like Noir, I'm not sure how to incorporate nyou voyeurism without having it take undertones of sexual harrassment/rape, too. It could still manage to be funny, but more in a cynical way. I'm still not up to that part in the actual writing, so anyone's got a few suggestions they'd be willing to part with?
Hmm. That's certainly tough. I have to say that part of the reason why you may not have gotten much of a response is because writing outside of one's comfort zone is hard. I can say immediately that if someone asked me to write a noir piece that I'd have no idea where to begin, unless it was a parody of noir, or a combination of noir and something else, like a pair of detectives who are also vampire hunters.
Uh, so I guess that's my contribution? A pair of (presumably male) detectives who are also vampire hunters, trying to find a vamp in the city who's stalking a young lady. The vamp may be either gender. And...go.
nkay, if your story is half as entertaining as your posts, I can't wait to read it. Every time I write something now I'm going to imagine myself as a mad scientist flipping a huge, rusty lever labeled "PORN" while lightning crashes outside, screaming "Raw pornaaaaaaaaage!"
Anyway, excellent criticism, even if it's probably nicer than I deserve. Normally I don't put a ton of effort into the plots of my stories for this site, and using established fictional properties acts as sort of a "shortcut" so I don't have to do as much legwork with the setup. Significantly, Method Acting is the only story I've ever written for Nyou Fiction that had original characters. If you really think it's that much better than the others, perhaps I'll try it again sometime. It was pretty fun to write.
As for your own story, wouldn't the voyeurism be less rapey if it was unintentional? What if instead of a femme fatale, the female lead is an ingenue who witnessed a mob killing or possesses some kind of key/locket/briefcase/gemstone/MacGuffin which puts her in danger, and the male lead has to (begrudgingly) protect her, possibly at the behest of a dead friend/partner or just for money. Any story in which the hero can't leave a woman's side has all kinds of opportunities for nyou occurrences. Maybe a hitman breaks in while she's in the bathroom, and the protagonist gets in a fist fight in front of her on the toilet. Or you could leverage the old "handcuffed together" gag. It seems to me like this setup would be less creepy than the protagonist just spying on women in the bathroom
Orpheum: That story could go interesting places.
Toasty: I like the idea of a detective who has to be close to the girl constantly. Reading your post gave me an idea. Suppose the bad guys use magic to do their dirty work? Like they can use it to assassinate people, make themselves immune to bullets, and so forth. Only for some reason there are some people whose auras dampen magic. So there's this cute chick who doesn't know what's going on who becomes the target of the bad guys because she screws up their magic just by being there. And our hero wants to figure out what the bad guys' overall mission is, and to protect her from harm. He can put up a decent fight against the bad guys so long as their magic is blocked, so he tries to stay within a couple feet of the girl at all times. She's not very happy about this, especially when she has to bathe or use the toilet.
Quote from: Jimmy Olsen on August 22, 2011, 10:22:35 PM
Orpheum: That story could go interesting places.
I'd imagine so, seeing as how it would start out fairly light hearted, like Harry Potter, and become gradually darker in that same way. Going from simple
Good vs. Evil to a sweeping epic about the terrors of war, love and loss, and just being possibly the most hardcore animated adventure series.
I was kind of expecting your Saturday morning cartoon to have more about nyou stuff.
As if that could ever be pulled on a children's show :P
Now an anime-esqe show, where the audience is more mature... maybe.
@Orpheum
QuoteHehehe, I'm always a little weary of revealing the idea online because of the fear that someone could steal it, but I guess it's nothing to be really concerned about.
Originally, the series started out a simple "play time" thing I had with some toys, except I had created quite a bit of backstory to each "character" (originally being McDonald Beast War toys), something most kids probably rarely did when just playing around pretend (at least more so than "This guy is a super warrior!"). Anyway, as I started to roll the idea of a series around, I incorporated elements of Dragon Ball Z, at the time being a very big fan, making it very action heavy. Granted, I was quick to make each character fight uniquely so it wasn't DBZ's "Everyone's a clone with the same move set".
I didn't ask because I figured you were reluctant to reveal more, but it's nice to see you're quite open about this. I think we were all guilty of this when we were younger!
You mentioned
Gainax (by which I assume you refer to
Evangelion), but are you a japanese tv show
aficionado per any chance? Your idea has a fantastically retro feel, and while I'm not sure how things work for American cartoons, it brings up to my mind elements of
Devilman and Shōwa-era
Kamen Rider. Those are considered pretty camp nowadays, but they were a bit more hardcore than what you'd see on this side of the Pacific.
Devilman (and in fact, a lot of Go Nagai's work) ended with everyone on both sides of the war dying, and the hero carrying away the
severed head of his love interest before getting himself finished off by Satan or something. And this was a manga for kids, so it's something that just wasn't
done...
@Bluesniper
QuoteUh, so I guess that's my contribution? A pair of (presumably male) detectives who are also vampire hunters, trying to find a vamp in the city who's stalking a young lady. The vamp may be either gender. And...go.
...You'd be surprised with how close you are to what I started with...I didn't have vampires, but there are eerie similarities.
At the moment, the plot I managed to conjure has to do with an idealistic detective and his mentor (a grizzled old cop) investigating a bordello, but running afoul the owner of the place, an abusive pimp who's also a capo for the local mob. The plot then starts revolving around the girls that are kept under control by their cocaine addiction, and how the detective becomes obsessed with doing the right thing for once: even if this means getting in trouble with the mob, and even if the girls themselves are too stoned to show any gratitude. It's...about as depressing and down-to-earth as it sounds.
Oh, and coke is known to cause constipation...so yeah~, pretty weak link to nyou content as it is right now, but that's what I have.
2 detectives, a powerful antagonist with sexual offender undertones, and a damsel in distress...hmm. Makes me wonder if there's a cliché here I'm not aware of.
QuoteHmm. That's certainly tough. I have to say that part of the reason why you may not have gotten much of a response is because writing outside of one's comfort zone is hard.
Oh, yes~. But the point of making contests is to pick out the best of the crop, and that's something done by pushing participants out of their comfort zone to see how they fare under different conditions. Being hard is the core of any challenge: staying hard while doing it is just a bonus (and no, I will not apologize for that horrible pun). But...oh well. I do understand that Duce has to play it the way he does because the number of entries is low enough as it is.
Parodies are fine! Again, I don't think parodies really get the respect they deserve. Sure, it's not the highest brow kind of writing, but people tend to underestimate how compelling it can be when channeled as postmodern commentary. You've got the usual shallow parodies, that don't really understand their material (think
Meet the Spartans) : and then you've got the good ones, which lampoon the more absurd aspects of the original source or juxtaposes it with contemporary bathos (like the
Naked Gun series). The
Noir genre has never seen vampires: they're more associated with horror, the gothic and (
very unfortunately) metrosexual heartthrobs. But there are gritty elements to vampires that would have meshed well regardless into a
Noir setting, so it would've been a surreal and unique approach.
Sort of in a "Who are we kidding, with all the bullshit we already have going on we might as well have vampires" kind of way.
Purposely pitching a premise that checks every item on the cliché list, and yet is so
bad, so
politically incorrect that there's no way in
hell it'd ever get serialized...it's food for thought.
@Toasty
QuoteAnyway, excellent criticism, even if it's probably nicer than I deserve. Normally I don't put a ton of effort into the plots of my stories for this site, and using established fictional properties acts as sort of a "shortcut" so I don't have to do as much legwork with the setup. Significantly, Method Acting is the only story I've ever written for Nyou Fiction that had original characters. If you really think it's that much better than the others, perhaps I'll try it again sometime. It was pretty fun to write.
Hey, I'm not saying that "raw pornage" is bad per se! There are great stories that take that approach: rather than that, my qualm is mostly with half-hearted fanfiction that attempts to be semi-serious and ends up coming through as lukewarm. It's when there's a lack of direction: if you're gonna go the porn way, at least write it with no compromise. To my fellow perverts I say,
be proud damn it!And, well, original content just has less canon chaining down the creative process (it also doubles as fewer excuses to be lazy with the writing).
Quote
As for your own story, wouldn't the voyeurism be less rapey if it was unintentional? What if instead of a femme fatale, the female lead is an ingenue who witnessed a mob killing or possesses some kind of key/locket/briefcase/gemstone/MacGuffin which puts her in danger, and the male lead has to (begrudgingly) protect her, possibly at the behest of a dead friend/partner or just for money. Any story in which the hero can't leave a woman's side has all kinds of opportunities for nyou occurrences. Maybe a hitman breaks in while she's in the bathroom, and the protagonist gets in a fist fight in front of her on the toilet. Or you could leverage the old "handcuffed together" gag. It seems to me like this setup would be less creepy than the protagonist just spying on women
in the bathroom
It's a good point, but there's a lot of typical "anime" approaches that would look really out of place in a more sleazy and mature environment as
Noir. Take for example the idea of making it intentional or not: a hardboiled character type is more likely to be a cad or an asexual than a good mama's boy. Femme fatales also offer another approach, as they could have become so used to being perceived as sexual objects that they now simply act nonchalant rather than ashamed. The MacGuffin approach didn't cross my mind though, and you're right, there's a bunch of ways to exploit that: plot twists, red herrings, not to mention driving home the fact that the characters need to be more pragmatic with their "accommodations". Hmmm...a bathroom fight could definitely be used though. Finally, the handcuff approach is just so damn...
kinky, I don't know if that'd work
wonders or just make the entire thing too contrived. That's also part of the reason why I don't personally like the protector/bodyguard device too much: too heavyhanded, too gimmicky...maybe even overdone, since the RE4 fics that have been floating on the site?
Thanks for the suggestions, Toasty.
Quote from: nkay7 on August 23, 2011, 12:05:04 AM
@Orpheum
I'd think you know if I'm into anime if you'd read my stories..... dork. :P Also, Gainax did do other series, like Fooly Cooly and Panty & Stocking.
But anyway, yea, the series I had in mind would channel things like Mighty Max, Pirate of Dark Water, early Gundam and the like, in that it wouldn't be kiddified Good and Evil, even though there are designated "Good" and "Evil" characters. The overall goal is to make a series not unlike Avatar that can be both appealing to children and adult, even though the latter half of the series would require being a bit more mature to appreciate the themes more greatly. It probably would be fairly contreversial, seeing as how one character's name (at least the moment) is
White Devil, and shares a similar backstory to Anubis from ronin warriors, in that he's a formerly evil minion who was being brainwashed into being evil.
And of course, death would be quite abundant in the series, much like One Piece, except with plenty of present day deaths instead of keeping it strictly to "past" events. (Though I am very well aware of that series' little "Surprise" recently).
By the way, I'd like to thank Nkay7 for saying such nice things about my stories. :)
If only the editors of fiction magazines had such a high opinion of my writing. :(
@Jimmy Olsen
QuoteBy the way, I'd like to thank Nkay7 for saying such nice things about my stories. :)
If only the editors of fiction magazines had such a high opinion of my writing. :(
Well Jimmy, in your case it might not be a question of writing ability, and more about just finding the right material to apply it to. And I know that's not saying much, because that's the
hardest part.
You mentionned dealing with editors: do you also have plans to professionally have work of fiction published?
Quick update:Story is 40% done, but no one cares about my pet project.
I know there are some people who'd like me to make more drawings, and it's only fair I give a heads up on my current situation so as to not create false hope.
I don't have free time right now. In fact, I've barely had time to sleep.
Things have been pretty crazy for me since Irene, with helping out the Red Cross in the relief efforts, and all the contigencies firing off at work. That's calmed down a bit, but it turns out I'm also getting assigned to a fast-lane project, and I'll be moving out to a new place for a while. Long story short, I don't even know myself when I'll get another break.
I'm one of those types that always have to be doing something, but even I have my limits!
My priorities are set in stone, but I'll return to finish what I've started once the dust settles.
Quote from: nkay7 on September 09, 2011, 04:13:32 PM
@Jimmy Olsen
QuoteBy the way, I'd like to thank Nkay7 for saying such nice things about my stories. :)
If only the editors of fiction magazines had such a high opinion of my writing. :(
Well Jimmy, in your case it might not be a question of writing ability, and more about just finding the right material to apply it to. And I know that's not saying much, because that's the hardest part.
You mentionned dealing with editors: do you also have plans to professionally have work of fiction published?
I've submitted short stories to magazines and contests, but none have been published. Not stuff about bedwetting schoolgirls or toilet goddesses, but stories that are in the same vein as what I see getting published.